Falling flowers in aeroponic closet !

[jokker]

Hello,
First I want to say fatalii is an amazing resource for chili lovers ! Thank you I love it.
I set up a closet in my non isolated garage with air intake on the bottom and extraction on top both connected to a thermostat for summer time (currently off, not hot enough). A thermostated heater is currently set on about 20C for the winter.
The closet is 54x96x200 cm on the inside and there is an aeroponic system  (platinum aerotop 10) with 10 plants inside (jalapenos, serranos...) and a 250w lamp (MH or HPS according to period). I use GHE flora mato and flora micro fertilizers.
The plants grew well under mh with ph 6 and EC from 0.60 to 2.0 and 18 hours lighting.
Since I switched to flowering, 13h and 30mn of HPS lighting, my EC is going up from 2.0 to 2.75 or so within a couple days the ph doesn't move though. What worries me is that 95% of the flowers fall off and I had only 4 jalapeños to eat. The floor of the closet is covered with dried flowers. I mean it.
I try to lower the EC by removing the solution every week and adding new one at EC 2.0 but it always goes up and up... The top of the plant is burning because it gets too close to the lamp, I have to trim the top very often keeping flowers from coming out and the plants became very leggy during blooming. I have flowers only on top but they all fall off eventually.
I think the fertilizers are not right for my chiles, the plants take what they need and leave the remaining in the solution, raising the EC.
For a 8L bucket I mix 16ml of flora micro and 24ml of flora mato (EC 2.0, tap water being at 0.5) and get the ph down to 6 exactly.
Maybe the proportions of fertilizers aren't right for the blooming period ? What do you think ?
Can you recommend me some other fertilizers (bottled, prepared, liquid form for hydroponics/aeroponics)
Perhaps BioSevia ?
The plants are taking ALL the space of the closet, I think 10 of them is a bit much in that small space. Should I start over a new culture with only 5 ?
Anyway, thanks for you help and answers.

David.

[Fredrik-flugarn]

Removal of nutrients doesn´t ´make EC rise! Removal of  water do. You could top of your solution with water to keep EC within limits. I grow my plants in DIY drippers and bubblers. Sometimes EC actually drops when the plants can use more nutrients but usually they drink more than they eat which makes EC climb. You can try to smoothly switch over to a more "bloom"-type of nutrient based on mainly PK? Works great for me to get them blooming and makes the pods stick.

[jokker]

Hi,

Thanks for the reply. Indeed the EC rises if the plant drinks and only eats part of the nutrients, I believe this is the issue in my case. What ferts would be ideal for chilies ? Does GHE make better stuff than flora micro/mato ? Bio sevia maybe ?
What do you mean by "smoothly switch" ? May I keep the current 20L of solution in the tank and top it off with 8L (size of my mixing bucket) of the new solution with bio sevia bloom ? And keep the momentum until next solution change being next Saturday or so ?

[-V-]

May I keep the current 20L of solution in the tank and top it off with 8L (size of my mixing bucket) of the new solution with bio sevia bloom ?

Basically, yes. But mixing different fertilizer systems (brands in this case) is not recommended, unwanted chemical reactions (e.g. nutrient salts crystallizing) may ensue. Stick with your system and simply add flowering solution when needed.

Few years ago FloraMicro & -Mato was considered one of the hydroponic nutrient systems for chiles, so it shouldn't be the culprit. It could be that your plants aren't getting enough light, 10 plants (even Jalapeños) per 1/2m2 is a bit much maybe. Also there is no need to shorten the photoperiod with chiles.

EDIT: So it seems that there is no "flowering" dosage for FloraMato. Luckily it doesn't matter with chiles, i could quickly estimate that about half of the chile growers in Finland are growing with one part fertilizer from seedling until the plant dies (and they don't usually die after one harvest like the plants that need different dosages for flowering).

[jokker]

Thanks for the input. So, bottom line is:
- switch the lighting back to, say, 16/8 ? (HPS ok? Or MH?)
- keep the EC around 2.0 with the same ferts mato/micro (2ml/L of micro and 3ml/L of mato)

Is that right ?

Thanks again

[-V-]

Thanks for the input. So, bottom line is:
- switch the lighting back to, say, 16/8 ? (HPS ok? Or MH?)
- keep the EC around 2.0 with the same ferts mato/micro (2ml/L of micro and 3ml/L of mato)

Is that right ?

That should work. Don't know which would be better, MH or HPS. HPS is said to cause bit more leggy growth but it also puts out more light than MH.

Removing every other plant should be considered, they could be potted in soil and placed on a windowsill.

EDIT: Here's a list for reasons for dropping flowers: http://thehotpepper.com/topic/37339-flowers-falling-off/page__hl__+flower%20+drop#entry775044

[jokker]

All right then, it's done for the light on a 16/8 cycle but I kept the 250w HPS in there. The EC keeps raising but I added some PH adjusted plain water to my solution, now back to 2.10.
I will stick to you guys advices and hopefully I will get some good jalapeños soon.
I will take some plants out this week end to soil pot them and see how they behave.
I'll try to keep you posted and I hope this will be useful to some other concerned chili lovers !

Thanks a bunch and see you later.

Edit: by the way, my aeroponic pump is on 24/7, I guess it's the best option right ?

[jokker]

Looking good so far I have most of the flowers setting pods !
Keep you posted.

[Fredrik-flugarn]

Great job!

With that excellent heading of yours people will find this topic. What have you done?

1) rather stable ec
...

I still suggest removing some plants (even though your heart will hurt)

and

cutting down on nitrogen in your nutrient solution (kind of smooth so you dont stress your plants) why not substitute a bit of mato for flora bloom or some other rather nitrogen free fertilizer? Keeping ec abot the same though. During my only one year experience with chilis I have succeeded pushing flowering by just lovering nitrogen levels my cajamarca is about to have its second winter harvest in a week or two. The last one was at about christmastime.

N - nitrogen: promotes the growth of leaves and vegetation
P - phosphorus: promotes root and shoot growth
K - potassium: promotes flowering and fruiting

Best regards and fingers crossed!

[jokker]

All right I got many serranos and jalapeños coming out, dozens and dozens.
Regarding EC I followed the posted recommendations about keeping the same dilution proportions (2.0 including 2ml/L of micro and 3ml/L of mato)
Topping with pain water with the right ph when going over 2.25 and going back down to 1.90-2.00... After a few days I add an 8L bucket with EC 2.0.... Seems to stabilize pretty well now. I learned not to feel the whole tank (about 40L) but instead keeping it on the low 20 and add solution, that way it gets stable somehow.
I removed 6 plants out of 10 that were not really producing anything, I realized that after cutting them off, they couldn't reach the "canopy" and were lost in the wild jungle, not very interesting then.
I switched the light on 17 hours a day.
I have a whole meter of "legs" from the root chamber to the canopy without NOTHING ! And about 50cm of thick jungle. I started new seeds to put outdoors and also start a new closet after I sacrifice these to start over and keep it low with legs.
Cheers !

[Fredrik-flugarn]

Good news! Nice to hear you have pods coming! : ) this time of year chilis are doing well in south facing windows as well (in Finland at least) the sun is low and reaches in nicely. Even chinenses starts to have pods sticking without extra light. Just a tip if you are running out of space :-D

[jokker]

Yep,

I actually started some seedlings in front of a south facing window... I'm just waiting for a safe non-frost period to take them out in bigger pots though.
In the meantime, I will put new seedlings in my closet and kind of compare both outdoor and indoor setup.

Keep you posted

Do you guys think the moruga scorpion kind is eatable ? I mean, since I love extremely hot peppers and I'm with a Mexican girl, I thought maybe I could give it a try... What do you think ? Did someone here try to bite into a fresh mature pod once ?

Cheers

[jokker]

Confirmed, it's all about lighting time ! 17 hours changes it all ! I get pounds and pounds of serrano peppers and jalapenos, the poblano plant struggle to produce, don't really know why... I still have two huge poblanos growing slowly but surely, that will be enough to cook some "Chiles Enogadas". I recommend to plant those outdoors though because it's taking a lot of space in a closet.
Also I recommend to avoid mixing kinds within the same closet, as far as I'm concerned I will set up two closets with exclusively jalapenos in one and serranos in the other.

I'm happy to announce that I know master these two kinds of chiles for indoor growing.

Little recap, it's easy:

- Use GHE FloraMicro / FloraMato fertilizers all the way from seedlings to fruiting
- EC:
-- 0.60 for seedlings
-- 1.00 on the first leaves
-- 1.50 on the mid-growing stage
-- 2.0 for both fully grown and fruiting stages
-- Avoid going over 2.0
- Light: I use a Grolux HPS that has both blue and red light for a good growth and flowering light all the way (I use 250W for 1.5 M²)
- Keep the chamber around 15C at night and 25-30C during the day period (I use air intake + extract on a thermostat + a heater for the winter, still on these days May 2nd )
- Change the solution every other week.

That way it is very easy to get very spicy serranos and jalapenos 

See you later.